To the Editor: More on 'separation of church and state'
Written by Chris Jackson   
Wednesday, 11 July 2012 09:14
I write in response to the 7/5/12 letter of Gerry A. Troyer regarding First Amendment rights and the "separation of church and state". He wrote criticizing a letter from Lloyd Jones that asked that elected officials avoid 'National Day of Prayer' activities.   His position is based on the view that the actual words "separation of church and state" are not in the First Amendment.  
It is true that the literal phrase "separation of church and state" does not appear in the Constitution, but that does not mean that the concept isn't there. The First Amendment says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…."
What does that mean? In an 1802 letter to the Danbury (Conn.) Baptist Association, Thomas Jefferson, then president, declared that the American people through the First Amendment had erected a "wall of separation between church and state."
Jefferson, however, was not the only leading figure of the post-revolutionary period to use the term separation.
James Madison, considered to be the Father of the Constitution, said in an 1819 letter, "The number, the industry and the morality of the priesthood and the devotion of the people have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the church from the state."
As church-state scholar Leo Pfeffer notes in his book, Church, State, and Freedom, "It is true, of course, that the phrase 'separation of church and state' does not appear in the Constitution. But it was inevitable that some convenient term should come into existence to verbalize a principle so clearly and widely held by the American people. The right to a fair trial is generally accepted to be a constitutional principle; yet the term 'fair trial' is not found in the Constitution. To bring the point even closer to home, who would deny that 'religious liberty' is a constitutional principle? Yet that phrase too is not in the Constitution. The universal acceptance of all these terms, including 'separation of church and state,' have received in America would seem to confirm rather than disparage their reality as basic American democratic principles."
Thus, it is entirely appropriate to speak of the 'constitutional principle of church and state separation' since that phrase summarizes what the First Amendment's religion clauses do - they separate church and state.
Our local elected officials should respect this separation and not participate in these religious activities.
Chris Jackson
Bowling Green
 

Comments  

 
# 2012-07-11 10:58
GREAT letter! Good job on your homework, Mr. Jackson!
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# 2012-07-11 14:04
I would like to reply to Chris's thoughts on the "separation of church and state."

The conclusion he comes to that elected officials should not participate in an event like the National Day of Prayer is not based on an understanding of the concept in the context of the time it was penned by Jefferson.

If you look at the time in which these words were penned, you will note that contemporaries of Jefferson often called for prayer. The First Continental Congress in 1775 called for a National Day of Prayer. A good source for other quotes: http://www.call2fall.com/classicquotes - the context of the time does not lend itself to Chris's interpretation of what our Founding Father's meant by this phrase/thought. Thank you.
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# 2012-07-11 16:13
The context of the time included slavery and religious persecution. The Founding Fathers are not necessarily a good example of ethical behavior. can we stop trying to rewrite history and just move forward with a REAL separation of church & state, please?
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# 2012-07-12 13:50
Readers would best be served by deciding the truth of this themselves. Aristotle once stated, "Wisdom is the knowledge of causes." Simply put, knowledge is an understanding of people, places and things. Wisdom is understanding the WHY. I would suggest readers find the original letters from the Danbury Baptist Association (all of them) and read all of the responses from Jefferson. You will find the cause of the letters (fear of an intrusive federal government) in the DBA letters, and assurances from Jefferson in his responses.

With the wisdom from understanding the causes of Jeffersons letters, you will be able to decide what truly is meant by "a wall of separation".
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# 2012-07-13 09:59
Why do we need Jefferson? Cannot we have our own MODERN separation?

The founding "fathers" are not necessarily legitimate authorities on ethical principles anyhow.
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# 2012-07-13 11:04
No, silly, we can't have our own modern interpretation of the Constitution any more than we can have our own modern interpretation of the Bible. They are both "divinely inspired," literal, true, and sufficient.

The Teapublicans are in possession of divine truth, so we might as well all give it up and bow.
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# 2012-07-13 15:25
Truly a biblical Solomenistic and constitutional problem. When does personal beliefs conflict with constitutional responsibility. Do we cut the baby in half or reach a rational solution. If the person involved sits on the dias it is a constitutional problem. If however he/she sits in the audience without recognition from the dias its a personal religious experience. I can live with a personal religious experience and don't wish to debate an unnecessary constitutional debate. After all most would consider attendance an indication of good moral and ethical standards. Prudence would dictate that sitting on the Dias might offend those of another persuation that the elected official would hold a bias against their beliefs. After all, John Adams wanted unfetered religious freedom not for Christians but for members of the Jewish faith.
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# 2012-07-15 15:37
Why do the rest of us have to conform our beliefs just because Obama and his lefty cronies don't like Christians?
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# 2012-07-15 19:01
How do you know President Obama does't like Christians? Did Fox news tell you that!!!
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# 2012-07-16 15:46
Quoting tigeer68:
How do you know President Obama does't like Christians? Did Fox news tell you that!!!

no obama is for abortion same as murder,christia ns do not do that.
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# 2012-07-17 07:33
nobody was talking about abortion, Tony. Are you seriously suggesting that anybody who sees abortion as complicated and painful but ultimately about the woman's right to control her own body is not a Christian? Saying "Obama is for abortion" is a statement at the reasoning level of a three-year old.
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# 2012-07-16 16:57
Christopher Williams the tea party is coming this Nov. Tiger68 fox is fare balance. Thats why you people to the left do not like fox.
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# 2012-07-17 07:31
Fox is a propaganda outlet that routinely spouts fictional nonsense as truth (I suppose because sanity has to be 'balanced' with insanity), and has led to the demonization not only liberals and anything that liberals support (even if it was once supported by Republicans), but of scientists and educators. Why have separate studies shown that Fox viewers are less well-informed than people who watch no TV news at all? Why do they work so hard to discredit other news sources? Why does almost nothing they report contradict or complicate their simplistic view of the world? Because what they call "fair and balanced" is all about telling stupid people what and how to think, telling them to distrust anybody who thinks that reality is complicated.
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# 2012-07-17 07:35
I'm all for fare balance, but frankly there isn't that much public transportation in NW Ohio.

Why does the Tea Party have such difficulty with spelling?
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# 2012-07-17 12:02
fox, that is why I don't listen to Fox news it is not fair and balanced! It could not be any more biased if it tried to. It is an arm of the republican and the teapublican parties!!!
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# 2012-07-16 21:18
Dwanye, this entire conversation is because the President attended the National Prayer Service. He belongs to the Church of Christ but hasn't attended services since conservatives went bonkers about his pastor. Talk about infringing on a mans religious liberty.
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# 2012-07-17 07:38
Actually, I thought the conversation stemmed from reactions to the local observance of the National Day of Prayer. And some of the same people now complaining that there should be no separation of church and state were complaining that the actual observance was too inclusive.

In fact, both Presidents Obama and G.W. Bush handled their National Prayer Service duties with humility and honesty, because they understood the need to speak thoughtfully in their own words but in keeping with their responsibility to speak to all people of all faiths. It's that concept that the local troglodytes find so offensive.
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# 2012-07-17 15:53
Christopher Williams I do not know how all of us have got through life with out you wisdom . (haha)
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# 2012-07-18 06:59
I do know that I have enjoyed a very happy life without your idiocy.

I don't make any special claims to wisdom, but you have clearly gotten through life without knowing the difference between sense and nonsense, and without feeling any need to be well-informed. Your only tool of argument is making fun of other people. And threatening some vague tea party revenge.
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# 2012-07-18 03:54
Don't feel bad, I heard these same type arguements in the 50's when i was in school.
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